Okay, so I'm a Brit living in Switzerland, and luckily the local
Swiss channel shows American and British (and some Australian) shows
and movies in the original English (via so-called two-channel tone:
left audio is dubbed into French or German, right audio is the original
language).

While I only infrequently watch Young and Restless (the 2002 episodes
- they are a bit behind the times here) I watched regularly
series like X-Files, Dead Zone, Roswell and Smallville, even Felicity
and Beverly Hills Ninethousandwhatever, even if they are only for
teenies.

Now I'm enjoying "Miss Match" and "Tru Calling"...BUT apparently
both series are discontinued.

That's a real pity, because they are really fun.

Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
viewer-polls?

Melanie
http://melaniesands.itgo.com

From:	jayembee
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Mon, 17 Jan 2005 07:31:11 GMT

Melanie_Sands@hotmail.com wrote:

> Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
> the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
> to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
> viewer-polls?

The only purpose that the networks have for broadcasting shows is to
make money by selling advertising time. Advertising revenue depends
solely on how many potential viewers there are for the ads. Since the
American networks get no revenue from foreign broadcasts, they don't
care about them. Nor, I hesitate to say, should they.

-- jayembee

From:	Ian J. Ball
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Mon, 17 Jan 2005 19:11:41 GMT

In article ,
jayembee wrote:

> Melanie_Sands@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> > Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
> > the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
> > to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
> > viewer-polls?
>
> The only purpose that the networks have for broadcasting shows is to
> make money by selling advertising time. Advertising revenue depends
> solely on how many potential viewers there are for the ads. Since the
> American networks get no revenue from foreign broadcasts, they don't
> care about them. Nor, I hesitate to say, should they.

If we can ever move to a subscription-based broadcasting model, instead
of the ridiculous advertiser-supported model we have now, they should,
and *will*, care about foreign markets!

--
"Some people come to embrace this parasite. They dress
it up in tiny clothes. Take it to play dates with
other parasites..." - Dr. Greg House, "House"
http://homepage.mac.com/ijball/TV.html

From:	KelL
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Wed, 19 Jan 2005 03:14:49 -0500

In article

,
"Ian J. Ball" wrote:

!In article ,
! jayembee wrote:
!
!> Melanie_Sands@hotmail.com wrote:
!>
!> > Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
!> > the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
!> > to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
!> > viewer-polls?
!>
!> The only purpose that the networks have for broadcasting shows is to
!> make money by selling advertising time. Advertising revenue depends
!> solely on how many potential viewers there are for the ads. Since the
!> American networks get no revenue from foreign broadcasts, they don't
!> care about them. Nor, I hesitate to say, should they.
!
!If we can ever move to a subscription-based broadcasting model,

we have it already. it's called CABLE

!instead
!of the ridiculous advertiser-supported model we have now, they should,
!and *will*, care about foreign markets!

--
KelL
AFTRA
"Religion is the most malevolent of all mind viruses."
--Sir Arthur C. Clarke

From:	Invid Fan
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Tue, 18 Jan 2005 00:06:24 -0500

In article

,
Ian J. Ball wrote:

> In article ,
> jayembee wrote:
>
> > Melanie_Sands@hotmail.com wrote:
> >
> > > Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
> > > the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
> > > to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
> > > viewer-polls?
> >
> > The only purpose that the networks have for broadcasting shows is to
> > make money by selling advertising time. Advertising revenue depends
> > solely on how many potential viewers there are for the ads. Since the
> > American networks get no revenue from foreign broadcasts, they don't
> > care about them. Nor, I hesitate to say, should they.
>
> If we can ever move to a subscription-based broadcasting model, instead
> of the ridiculous advertiser-supported model we have now, they should,
> and *will*, care about foreign markets!

No, it's up to the PRODUCERS of the show to care about foreign markets!
If sales overseas alone will pay for the cost of production, then US
sales won't matter.

--
Chris Mack "Refugee, total shit. That's how I've always seen us.
'Invid Fan' Not a help, you'll admit, to agreement between us."
-'Deal/No Deal', CHESS

From:	Ian J. Ball
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Tue, 18 Jan 2005 06:30:03 GMT

In article <180120050006247144%invid@localnet.com>,
Invid Fan wrote:

> In article
> ,
> Ian J. Ball wrote:
> >
> > If we can ever move to a subscription-based broadcasting model, instead
> > of the ridiculous advertiser-supported model we have now, they should,
> > and *will*, care about foreign markets!
>
> No, it's up to the PRODUCERS of the show to care about foreign markets!
> If sales overseas alone will pay for the cost of production, then US
> sales won't matter.

I think what you say is only true about syndicated shows. With broadcast
network shows, the others in this thread were right - they really
*don't* care about foreign markets.

--
"Some people come to embrace this parasite. They dress
it up in tiny clothes. Take it to play dates with
other parasites..." - Dr. Greg House, "House"
http://homepage.mac.com/ijball/TV.html

From:	Invid Fan
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Tue, 18 Jan 2005 16:01:54 -0500

In article

,
Ian J. Ball wrote:

> In article <180120050006247144%invid@localnet.com>,
> Invid Fan wrote:
>
> > In article
> > ,
> > Ian J. Ball wrote:
> > >
> > > If we can ever move to a subscription-based broadcasting model, instead
> > > of the ridiculous advertiser-supported model we have now, they should,
> > > and *will*, care about foreign markets!
> >
> > No, it's up to the PRODUCERS of the show to care about foreign markets!
> > If sales overseas alone will pay for the cost of production, then US
> > sales won't matter.
>
> I think what you say is only true about syndicated shows. With broadcast
> network shows, the others in this thread were right - they really
> *don't* care about foreign markets.

Baywatch was a network show, which was canceled. The producers saw that
overseas sales were enough to cover costs, so continued production. If
the network has no involvement in a series apart from agreeing to air
it, yes they don't care. Those that do own the show however just want
it to bring in enough income to make a profit... no matter where it
comes from. If the BBC for example paid enough to cover a second season
of Firefly, do you think the fact that Fox had canceled the series
would matter to the studio? They'd keep making episodes, regardless of
if they found a US market other then dvd sales.

--
Chris Mack "Refugee, total shit. That's how I've always seen us.
'Invid Fan' Not a help, you'll admit, to agreement between us."
-'Deal/No Deal', CHESS

From:	Brent McKee
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Mon, 17 Jan 2005 07:45:34 GMT

wrote in message
news:1105911786.465592.166250@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Okay, so I'm a Brit living in Switzerland, and luckily the local
> Swiss channel shows American and British (and some Australian) shows
> and movies in the original English (via so-called two-channel tone:
> left audio is dubbed into French or German, right audio is the original
> language).
>
> While I only infrequently watch Young and Restless (the 2002 episodes
> - they are a bit behind the times here) I watched regularly
> series like X-Files, Dead Zone, Roswell and Smallville, even Felicity
> and Beverly Hills Ninethousandwhatever, even if they are only for
> teenies.
>
> Now I'm enjoying "Miss Match" and "Tru Calling"...BUT apparently
> both series are discontinued.
>
> That's a real pity, because they are really fun.
>
> Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
> the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
> to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
> viewer-polls?

Simple answer is that they don't care, but why they don't care is important.
As you undoubtedly know, US TV networks make money through advertising so
the more people who watch the show the more money advertisers are willing to
pay. That's why the ratings are important -- they show the advertisers what
shows people are watching. It's not just what people are watching but what
specific groups are watching, some groups being more desirable than others.
What you may not be as aware of is that most of the time networks don't
produce their own shows; that's done by production companies, often working
with major movie studios. Thus any money coming from selling the show
internationally doesn't go to the network, it goes to the producers, so the
networks don't care how well a show does outside of an area where they don't
sell advertising. Aha you say, so why don't production companies keep
making series for the foreign markets after the show is cancelled?
Occasionally they do -- "Baywatch" is a prime example -- it could be sold
internationally largely because the Germans (for reasons known only to the
Germans) thought that David Hasselhoff could sing and would watch anything
that Hasselhoff appeared in. In most cases however the money made from
international sales is a fraction of the total production costs, because
international networks usually pay a far lower price than what the companies
are being paid by a US network. In order to make the shows the production
companies need a US network to order the show -- international sales are
mostly just the icing on the cake.

--
Brent McKee http://brentmckee.blogspot.com/

To reply by email, please remove the capital letters (S and N) from
the email address

"If we cease to judge this world, we may find ourselves, very quickly,
in one which is infinitely worse."
- Margaret Atwood

"Nothing is more dangerous than a dogmatic worldview - nothing more
constraining, more blinding to innovation, more destructive of
openness to novelty. "
- Stephen Jay Gould (1941-2002)

From:	Invid Fan
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Sun, 16 Jan 2005 18:14:18 -0500

In article <1105911786.465592.166250@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
wrote:

> Okay, so I'm a Brit living in Switzerland, and luckily the local
> Swiss channel shows American and British (and some Australian) shows
> and movies in the original English (via so-called two-channel tone:
> left audio is dubbed into French or German, right audio is the original
> language).
>
> While I only infrequently watch Young and Restless (the 2002 episodes
> - they are a bit behind the times here) I watched regularly
> series like X-Files, Dead Zone, Roswell and Smallville, even Felicity
> and Beverly Hills Ninethousandwhatever, even if they are only for
> teenies.
>
> Now I'm enjoying "Miss Match" and "Tru Calling"...BUT apparently
> both series are discontinued.
>
> That's a real pity, because they are really fun.
>
> Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
> the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
> to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
> viewer-polls?
>
Well, the US networks only care about US viewers naturally. The
producers of the shows, however, do take you foriegn chaps into
consideration. The most famous case is Baywatch, which we had the good
sense to cancel, but they found there was enough money to be made
overseas to keep it in production. It then was offered for first fun
syndication in the US.

What it comes down to, really, is if overseas sales are enough to cover
the budget. If the answer is yes, they can just ignore the US ratings
and keep production going. Hell, 'Andromeda' managed to have its entire
first three or so seasons paid for from foriegn sales before the first
episode was even shot.

If you want US shows that aren't successful here, it's up to your local
networks to get the money to keep them going.

--
Chris Mack "Refugee, total shit. That's how I've always seen us.
'Invid Fan' Not a help, you'll admit, to agreement between us."
-'Deal/No Deal', CHESS

From:	CSIS Agent $formerly steven blue$
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Sun, 16 Jan 2005 21:57:58 GMT

> That's a real pity, because they are really fun.
>
> Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
> the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
> to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
> viewer-polls?

They only care if its profitable in the States. If it isn't then they cancel
the series no matter how popular they are in the UK.

From:	Major ChrisB
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Sun, 16 Jan 2005 22:35:42 -0000

"CSIS Agent (formerly steven blue)" wrote in message
news:GrBGd.104782$dv1.3561@edtnps89...
>
>> That's a real pity, because they are really fun.
>>
>> Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
>> the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
>> to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
>> viewer-polls?
>
> They only care if its profitable in the States. If it isn't then they
> cancel the series no matter how popular they are in the UK.

USA is all the matter to the US networks....the main exporter of US shows is
to the UK, where I live, and I'm sure theres less viewers of CSI in one
state in the US than there are for the whole of the UK when CSI airs on
LivingTV

The only shows I've ever heard of the UK having any influence over were Due
South and Dark Skies. Due South is one of the vew few US Shows which I ever
remember being treated well in the UK and it was aired on BBC 1 in a good
time slot (saturday evening around 8pm IIRC) and when it was announced as
being canceled some kind of deal was made for them to at least finish the
season they were on.

Channel 4 in the UK and the Sci-Fi Channel in the US almost got Dark Skies
renewed when Fox canceled it but the studio ended up saying they'd only do
it if the actors playing John, Kim and Frank signed on again and they all
did, story ideas were being approved and they were almost at the
pre-production stage of writing scripts and things when JT Walsh died and
the whole thing got canned

From:	CSIS Agent $formerly steven blue$
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Mon, 17 Jan 2005 00:30:01 GMT

"Major ChrisB" wrote in message
news:Q_BGd.630$Fi3.407@text.usenetserver.com...
>
> "CSIS Agent (formerly steven blue)" wrote in
> message news:GrBGd.104782$dv1.3561@edtnps89...
>>
>>> That's a real pity, because they are really fun.
>>>
>>> Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
>>> the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
>>> to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
>>> viewer-polls?
>>
>> They only care if its profitable in the States. If it isn't then they
>> cancel the series no matter how popular they are in the UK.
>
> USA is all the matter to the US networks....the main exporter of US shows
> is to the UK, where I live, and I'm sure theres less viewers of CSI in one
> state in the US than there are for the whole of the UK when CSI airs on
> LivingTV
>
> The only shows I've ever heard of the UK having any influence over were
> Due South and Dark Skies. Due South is one of the vew few US Shows which
> I ever remember being treated well in the UK and it was aired on BBC 1 in
> a good time slot (saturday evening around 8pm IIRC) and when it was
> announced as being canceled some kind of deal was made for them to at
> least finish the season they were on.

I believe Due South was kept around thanks to the Canadians. As it was
produced here and the ratings were good they kept production going on. With
no doubt I bet that the UK had an influence in the decision.

From:	KelL
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Sun, 16 Jan 2005 23:52:38 -0500

In article <1105911786.465592.166250@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
Melanie_Sands@hotmail.com wrote:

!Okay, so I'm a Brit living in Switzerland, and luckily the local
!Swiss channel shows American and British (and some Australian) shows
!and movies in the original English (via so-called two-channel tone:
!left audio is dubbed into French or German, right audio is the original
!language).
!
!While I only infrequently watch Young and Restless (the 2002 episodes
!- they are a bit behind the times here) I watched regularly
!series like X-Files, Dead Zone, Roswell and Smallville, even Felicity
!and Beverly Hills Ninethousandwhatever, even if they are only for
!teenies.
!
!Now I'm enjoying "Miss Match" and "Tru Calling"...BUT apparently
!both series are discontinued.
!
!That's a real pity, because they are really fun.
!
!Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
!the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
!to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
!viewer-polls?

They only care about the ad revenue... hence the reason why programs are
now shot in 5 week increments. used to be a show was on for 26 weeks,
then 13... now if it don't hit immediately, it's gone.

!
!Melanie
!http://melaniesands.itgo.com

--
KelL
AFTRA
"Religion is the most malevolent of all mind viruses."
--Sir Arthur C. Clarke

From:	The Starmaker
Subject:	Re: To cancel or not to cancel...the series
Date:	Mon, 17 Jan 2005 19:05:52 GMT

KelL wrote:
>
> In article <1105911786.465592.166250@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
> Melanie_Sands@hotmail.com wrote:
>
> !Okay, so I'm a Brit living in Switzerland, and luckily the local
> !Swiss channel shows American and British (and some Australian) shows
> !and movies in the original English (via so-called two-channel tone:
> !left audio is dubbed into French or German, right audio is the original
> !language).
> !
> !While I only infrequently watch Young and Restless (the 2002 episodes
> !- they are a bit behind the times here) I watched regularly
> !series like X-Files, Dead Zone, Roswell and Smallville, even Felicity
> !and Beverly Hills Ninethousandwhatever, even if they are only for
> !teenies.
> !
> !Now I'm enjoying "Miss Match" and "Tru Calling"...BUT apparently
> !both series are discontinued.
> !
> !That's a real pity, because they are really fun.
> !
> !Do the producers ever imagine that other viewers in the rest of
> !the, non-USA, world are enthusiastic fans and would like the series
> !to continue, or do they just care about their own, unreliable
> !viewer-polls?
>
> They only care about the ad revenue... hence the reason why programs are
> now shot in 5 week increments. used to be a show was on for 26 weeks,
> then 13... now if it don't hit immediately, it's gone.

The truth is...
It's not the advertisers fault.

The television people are lying to the advertisers about how many people
watch the show.

By the time the advertisers find out they have been lied to, they stop
advertising.

By that time, the TV people come up with a new show and lie to them
again.

The Starmaker