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 | | From: | Steve Goltra | | Subject: | Re: Open View Theism | | Date: | Wed, 19 Jan 2005 00:17:24 GMT |
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 | Muz:
I thought that I was very, very clear in what I was posting when I posted
the Abrahamic Blood Covenant. In that Covenant God swares to Abraham that he
and his descendents (not descendent) would be participants in it. Moses was
well aware of this covenant. Also, just to be crystal clear on this matter,
God has never, ever, not once come against all of his people (the Jews) save
one or two, and annihilated them. Granted, when the law was given three
thousand were killed (by men, not God, but on the orders of God), but at
that time there were approximately 3 million Jews alive. At Pentecost 3,000
believed and were saved and received eternal life. God has used other
nations to judge Israel, but at the same time if those nations were to
severe in that judgment, he came against them. When God chose Abraham, he
chose him and his descendents to covenant with- an everlasting covenant. The
Angel of the Lord has defended the Jews in battle over and over again,
totally annihilating other nations, but the Angel of the Lord has never,
ever come against His Chosen people, regardless of how much idolatry they
were into or how backslidden they were, and annihilated them himself.
I guess my problem with your position on this whole matter is that you would
ever even think that God would annihilate his chosen people. No matter what
the text says, with your understanding of Scripture and God's Covenant
relationship with Israel, how can you come to such a conclusion. It might be
that you are not using your understanding of God's nature and God's plan in
coming to this conclusion. It might be that you are just too "literal" in
your reading of the text, without applying any understanding to God's
Covenant relationship to Israel. Nicodemus had the same type of problem.
This is what God's Word says about the Abrahamic covenant, an EVERLASTING
Covenant". Please note that it is quite clear that is addressed to Abraham
and his descendents (Jews) as an everlasting covenant, FOR THE GENERATIONS
TO COME:
An Everlasting Covenant .
Genesis 17:7-9 I will establish my covenant as an everlasting covenant
between me and you and your descendants after you for the generations to
come, to be your God and the God of YOUR DESCENDENTS after you.The whole
land of Canaan, where you are now an alien, I will give as an everlasting
possession to you and YOUR DESCENDENTS after you; and I will be THEIR God."
Then God said to Abraham, "As for you, you must keep my covenant, you and
YOUR DESCENDENTS after you for THE GENERATIONS TO COME.
Also, in your concern about the land promised to Abraham- All of that land
has never been in the hands of Israel. Even today, they only control less
than 1% of what God promised them. They will receive all of the land during
the Millennial reign of Jesus Christ.
God bless,
Steve
"Muz" wrote in message
news:K_9Hd.9823$pZ4.5314@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> >I am not "abandoning my position" on anything.
>
> Well, you failed to deal with the obvious contradiction of your own
> position, so there was no other logical conclusion.
>
>>I read the Bible through 5 times when Iwas in the New Age
>
> I'm glad you found your way to Christ and the indwelling of the Holy
> Spirit. Welcome to the family.
>
>>It is quite
>>clear that what I have posted, as well as other's on this thread, have
> not
>>softened your heart or opened your eyes to the truth.
>
> Ah, yes, the last vestige of the defeated: "God told me that this is
> true, so you must be wrong in spite of my obvious lack of knowledge and
> inability to deal with the problems of my position."
>
> Honestly, Steve, discussion is about an examination of doctrines. Its
> purpose is to bring to the surface the errors and problems with one's
> position so that it may be refined. I've opened up and laid out my
> case, answered your questions, and have found our discussion
> beneficial. I suspect it is you that is unwilling to consider the
> problems we've encountered in your position, having cast it in
> concrete.
>
> I was not honestly expecting you to change your mind as a result of our
> conversation, but I had hoped for something more than this kind of
> conclusion.
>
> Muz
>
>
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