 | | From: | Spartanicus | | Subject: | Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 15:37:38 +0000 |
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 | http://www.useit.com/ displays email contact addresses as user@domain
appended with images that display ".com" to prevent email address
harvesting (bottom of page). I have Opera configured to display cached
images only, Opera only showed the user@domain bit.
I almost launched a rant about what a nitwit usability expert Jakob
Nielsen must be, luckily I viewed the html before doing that, and there
it was: alt="dotcom". Opera suppressed the alt content in "cached images
only" mode.
I can't figure out what Makes Opera do that on this particular page, the
code is not part of a table (I'm used to Opera not showing alt content
in tables), it does work on other pages.
Anybody else get this?
--
Spartanicus
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| | From: | Spartanicus | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:02:47 +0000 |
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| Spartanicus wrote:
>I can't figure out what Makes Opera do that on this particular page
Figured it out, it's caused by the specified height of the image. Filing
a bug report.
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Spartanicus
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| | From: | Geoff Morris | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 21:05:33 +0100 |
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| On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:02:47 +0000, Spartanicus wrote:
> Spartanicus wrote:
>
>> I can't figure out what Makes Opera do that on this particular page
>
> Figured it out, it's caused by the specified height of the image. Filing
> a bug report.
How amazingly ironic - I was just thinking about this long-standing Opera
bug (at least the last three years) two days ago!
I first encountered it in 2001 when making my first photo album which
contains thumbnails in tables. This week I was adding a Christmas album
and noticed that the behaviour is *STILL* screwed up...
In my case it's the tables that kill it (in this latest album I don't even
specify thumbnail dimensions, in older albums I did specify width and/or
height).
While the page is loading with graphics on, you can see the text in the
thumbnail spaces, if you then turn graphics off the table cells will all
collapse to just a few pixels square. I remember in other cases (I think
without tables) I've seen the text so long as the page was loaded fresh
with graphics off. If graphics were later switched on and off then the
image spacer had collapsed as well.
IMO if the height or width isn't defined then the render engine should
allow the spacer to assume the text dimensions, forcing text wrapping if
the window width is exceeded by the (total) content width. This should
affect table cells in just the same way as images would.
--
Geoff
Sorry about the munged address - too many viruses out there!
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| | From: | Steve Pugh | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:00:22 +0000 |
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| Spartanicus wrote:
>http://www.useit.com/ displays email contact addresses as user@domain
>appended with images that display ".com" to prevent email address
>harvesting (bottom of page). I have Opera configured to display cached
>images only, Opera only showed the user@domain bit.
>
>I almost launched a rant about what a nitwit usability expert Jakob
>Nielsen must be, luckily I viewed the html before doing that, and there
>it was: alt="dotcom". Opera suppressed the alt content in "cached images
>only" mode.
It shows for me, at least that part of it which fits inside the image
box - so the top half of the letters 'dotco'.
Steve
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| | From: | Spartanicus | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:16:21 +0000 |
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| Steve Pugh wrote:
>It shows for me, at least that part of it which fits inside the image
>box - so the top half of the letters 'dotco'.
Strange, nothing is displayed here until I increase the specified size
to 11, at the default 10 nothing shows.
--
Spartanicus
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| | From: | Steve Pugh | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:20:28 +0000 |
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| Spartanicus wrote:
>Steve Pugh wrote:
>
>>It shows for me, at least that part of it which fits inside the image
>>box - so the top half of the letters 'dotco'.
>
>Strange, nothing is displayed here until I increase the specified size
>to 11, at the default 10 nothing shows.
Ah, I've got my minimum font size set to 12px.
Does useit.com really specify a font-size of 10px? The image looks
like it's meant to match larger text than that. Or are you saying that
your default font size is 10px? (factory default being 16px).
Steve
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| | From: | Spartanicus | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:45:57 +0000 |
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| Steve Pugh wrote:
>>Strange, nothing is displayed here until I increase the specified size
>>to 11, at the default 10 nothing shows.
>
>Ah, I've got my minimum font size set to 12px.
>
>Does useit.com really specify a font-size of 10px? The image looks
>like it's meant to match larger text than that.
The image is sized height="10", if I edit the html file and increase
that to 11 and reload from the cache, only then does the text show.
Setting my minimum font size to 12 doesn't make a difference for me.
--
Spartanicus
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| | From: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 23:08:20 +0100 |
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| On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 16:45:57 +0000, Spartanicus wrote:
> Steve Pugh wrote:
>>> Strange, nothing is displayed here until I increase the specified size
>>> to 11, at the default 10 nothing shows.
>>
>> Ah, I've got my minimum font size set to 12px.
>>
>> Does useit.com really specify a font-size of 10px? The image looks
>> like it's meant to match larger text than that.
>
> The image is sized height="10", if I edit the html file and increase
> that to 11 and reload from the cache, only then does the text show.
>
> Setting my minimum font size to 12 doesn't make a difference for me.
IIANM, this is a design decision, to spare you from cutoff 'spacer image'
alt texts and generic 'image' placeholders for images without alt text.
--
The Web is a procrastination apparatus: | Rijk van Geijtenbeek
It can absorb as much time as | Documentation & QA
is required to ensure that you | Opera Software ASA
won't get any real work done. - J.Nielsen
|http://my.opera.com/Rijk/journal
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| | From: | Spartanicus | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Fri, 14 Jan 2005 23:51:29 +0000 |
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| "Rijk van Geijtenbeek" wrote:
>> The image is sized height="10", if I edit the html file and increase
>> that to 11 and reload from the cache, only then does the text show.
>>
>> Setting my minimum font size to 12 doesn't make a difference for me.
>
>IIANM, this is a design decision, to spare you from cutoff 'spacer image'
>alt texts and generic 'image' placeholders for images without alt text.
The alt content is shown in "show no images" mode, just not in "cached
images mode".
Plus Steve does see the alt content.
--
Spartanicus
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| | From: | Steve Pugh | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Sat, 15 Jan 2005 11:13:10 +0000 |
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| Spartanicus wrote:
>"Rijk van Geijtenbeek" wrote:
>
>>> The image is sized height="10", if I edit the html file and increase
>>> that to 11 and reload from the cache, only then does the text show.
>>>
>>> Setting my minimum font size to 12 doesn't make a difference for me.
>>
>>IIANM, this is a design decision, to spare you from cutoff 'spacer image'
>>alt texts and generic 'image' placeholders for images without alt text.
>
>The alt content is shown in "show no images" mode, just not in "cached
>images mode".
>
>Plus Steve does see the alt content.
I've worked out why I saw it but you didn't.
You have Opera set to 'display cached images only'. If I go to the
site with that setting then I don't see any alt text. However, I went
there with 'display no image's set and then changed to 'display cached
images only'. This causes the full alt to display and then to get
truncated to the size of the image box when I changed mode.
Steve
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| | From: | Geoff Morris | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Sat, 15 Jan 2005 14:04:20 +0100 |
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| On Sat, 15 Jan 2005 11:13:10 +0000, Steve Pugh wrote:
> You have Opera set to 'display cached images only'. If I go to the
> site with that setting then I don't see any alt text. However, I went
> there with 'display no image's set and then changed to 'display cached
> images only'. This causes the full alt to display and then to get
> truncated to the size of the image box when I changed mode.
But it still doesn't even work "by design" in my case of visiting a page
containing images within tables - even "no images" will show a tiny,
crushed honeycomb instead of the large table containing alternate text.
--
Geoff
Sorry about the munged address - too many viruses out there!
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| | From: | Spartanicus | | Subject: | Re: Alt content sometimes not showing in "show cached images only" mode | | Date: | Sat, 15 Jan 2005 15:58:03 +0000 |
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| "Geoff Morris" wrote:
>> You have Opera set to 'display cached images only'. If I go to the
>> site with that setting then I don't see any alt text. However, I went
>> there with 'display no image's set and then changed to 'display cached
>> images only'. This causes the full alt to display and then to get
>> truncated to the size of the image box when I changed mode.
>
>But it still doesn't even work "by design" in my case of visiting a page
>containing images within tables - even "no images" will show a tiny,
>crushed honeycomb instead of the large table containing alternate text.
That is indeed also an issue, but a different one than the one under
discussion.
--
Spartanicus
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