 | | From: | Scotoma | | Subject: | 16 year old has £19k over paid into bank account. | | Date: | Sat, 08 Jan 2005 19:53:17 GMT |
|
|
 | Hi all
How does he stand legally? Is he legally obliged to tell the bank of their
error? If he keeps quiet will this be classed as theft?
Any legal info only would be great.
Scotoma
|
|
| | From: | Charles Ellson | | Subject: | Re: 16 year old has ?19k over paid into bank account. | | Date: | Sat, 08 Jan 05 21:14:27 GMT |
|
|
| In article
me@play.co.uk "Scotoma" writes:
> Hi all
>
> How does he stand legally?
The circumstances as described infer that he has no reason to believe
that he has good title to it. So he's standing on very unfirm ground.
> Is he legally obliged to tell the bank of their error?
>
Er....
Assuming this is not a hypothetical question, keeping quiet about it
would not seem to be an example of acting in good faith so even if no
criminal offence is committed I wouldn't be so sure that he would be immune
against civil action if another party suffers loss and has a bigger
lawyer than he has; if someone has several thousands going astray
it is quite foreseeable that they could have consequential losses.
> If he keeps quiet will this be classed as theft?
>
If he uses it, it certainly is theft. ITYF there have been a couple of
relevant cases reported in the press in the last year or so.
--
_______
+---------------------------------------------------+ |\\ //|
| Charles Ellson: charles@e11son.demon.co.uk | | \\ // |
+---------------------------------------------------+ | > < |
| // \\ |
Alba gu brath |//___\\|
|
|
| | From: | Scotoma | | Subject: | Re: 16 year old has ?19k over paid into bank account. | | Date: | Sun, 09 Jan 2005 01:25:35 GMT |
|
|
|
"Charles Ellson" wrote in message
news:1105218867snz@ellson.demon.co.uk...
> In article
> me@play.co.uk "Scotoma" writes:
>
> > Hi all
> >
> > How does he stand legally?
> The circumstances as described infer that he has no reason to believe
> that he has good title to it. So he's standing on very unfirm ground.
>
> > Is he legally obliged to tell the bank of their error?
> >
> Er....
> Assuming this is not a hypothetical question, keeping quiet about it
> would not seem to be an example of acting in good faith so even if no
> criminal offence is committed I wouldn't be so sure that he would be
immune
> against civil action if another party suffers loss and has a bigger
> lawyer than he has; if someone has several thousands going astray
> it is quite foreseeable that they could have consequential losses.
>
> > If he keeps quiet will this be classed as theft?
> >
> If he uses it, it certainly is theft. ITYF there have been a couple of
> relevant cases reported in the press in the last year or so.
> --
Thank you for your reply.
This has actually happened and I was wondering the legal side of things
should he decide to keep it.
Thanks again. :-)
Scotoma
|
|
| | From: | Don | | Subject: | Re: 16 year old has ?19k over paid into bank account. | | Date: | Sun, 9 Jan 2005 17:03:56 -0000 |
|
|
| "Scotoma" wrote in message
news:jK%Dd.6479$GG1.2295@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
>
The answer to this would appear to be that a constructive trust is created
and the 19 year old is obliged to hold the funds safely and to inform the
bank and return the funds to the true owner.
Even keeping quiet about it could be regarded as analogous to theft by
finding. There is a positive duty to inform the owner or his bank that the
money has been received in error.
If the money were knowingly used - I wonder whether this might be
embezzlement rather than theft since there is a constructive trust?
regards
Don
|
|
| | From: | Charles Ellson | | Subject: | Re: 16 year old has ?19k over paid into bank account. | | Date: | Sun, 09 Jan 05 20:53:27 GMT |
|
|
| In article don@yahoo.co.uk "Don" writes:
> "Scotoma" wrote in message
> news:jK%Dd.6479$GG1.2295@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> >
> The answer to this would appear to be that a constructive trust is created
> and the 19 year old is obliged to hold the funds safely and to inform the
> bank and return the funds to the true owner.
>
> Even keeping quiet about it could be regarded as analogous to theft by
> finding. There is a positive duty to inform the owner or his bank that the
> money has been received in error.
>
> If the money were knowingly used - I wonder whether this might be
> embezzlement rather than theft since there is a constructive trust?
>
I suspect the PF might apply KISS and head toward the "stealing by
finding"-ish route(s) to avoid painting himself into a corner with the
latter which might be more precise than circumstances require.
--
_______
+---------------------------------------------------+ |\\ //|
| Charles Ellson: charles@e11son.demon.co.uk | | \\ // |
+---------------------------------------------------+ | > < |
| // \\ |
Alba gu brath |//___\\|
|
|
| | From: | Scotoma | | Subject: | Re: 16 year old has £19k over paid into bank account. | | Date: | Mon, 10 Jan 2005 01:54:34 GMT |
|
|
|
"Charles Ellson" wrote in message
news:1105304007snz@ellson.demon.co.uk...
> In article don@yahoo.co.uk "Don"
writes:
>
> > "Scotoma" wrote in message
> > news:jK%Dd.6479$GG1.2295@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> > >
> > The answer to this would appear to be that a constructive trust is
created
> > and the 19 year old is obliged to hold the funds safely and to inform
the
> > bank and return the funds to the true owner.
> >
> > Even keeping quiet about it could be regarded as analogous to theft by
> > finding. There is a positive duty to inform the owner or his bank that
the
> > money has been received in error.
> >
> > If the money were knowingly used - I wonder whether this might be
> > embezzlement rather than theft since there is a constructive trust?
> >
> I suspect the PF might apply KISS and head toward the "stealing by
> finding"-ish route(s) to avoid painting himself into a corner with the
> latter which might be more precise than circumstances require.
> --
> _______
> +---------------------------------------------------+ |\\ //|
> | Charles Ellson: charles@e11son.demon.co.uk | | \\ // |
> +---------------------------------------------------+ | > < |
> | // \\ |
> Alba gu brath |//___\\|
>
Thank you both very much for your information. I will be sure to pass it on
to the lad. :-)
|
|
